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Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2024 12:04 am
by dubois35
To answer this directly:
Idle/standing power draw is often surprisingly close to a meaningful fraction of active walking power draw once you account for onboard compute, sensors, and balance-holding torque - 'doing nothing' still costs real energy on a humanoid. A BMS (battery management system) has to guard against transient current spikes from sudden gait changes or lifting motions, not just steady-state draw - peak current headroom and fast-acting protection logic matter as much as total capacity for real-world duty cycles.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2024 7:08 pm
by matthew43
@dubois35 Yeah, this tracks with what I've read as well.
Thermal margin in a densely packed humanoid chassis is often the real limiting factor on sustained performance, not raw motor power - actuators get thermally throttled well before they'd hit their absolute torque limits, especially during repeated high-load cycles like continuous lifting. Best-in-class lithium-ion cells used in humanoids are currently landing around 280-300 Wh/kg, which is respectable but still leaves battery mass as one of the largest single contributors to total robot weight.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2024 12:35 am
by scott21
Yeah, this tracks with what I've read as well.
Best-in-class lithium-ion cells used in humanoids are currently landing around 280-300 Wh/kg, which is respectable but still leaves battery mass as one of the largest single contributors to total robot weight.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2024 7:08 am
by servoken70
@scott21 Genuinely curious -
Distributed power architectures (multiple smaller packs or local capacitor buffering near high-draw actuators) can reduce peak current demands on the main bus and improve fault isolation, at the cost of added complexity versus a single central pack.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Wed Dec 18, 2024 4:14 am
by park44
That's the official framing, at least - reality tends to lag a bit.
Thermal margin in a densely packed humanoid chassis is often the real limiting factor on sustained performance, not raw motor power - actuators get thermally throttled well before they'd hit their absolute torque limits, especially during repeated high-load cycles like continuous lifting. Fast charging accelerates capacity fade over repeated cycles, so fleet operators generally have to choose between minimizing downtime (fast charging) and maximizing pack lifespan (slower charging or swap-based approaches) rather than getting both for free.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Fri Dec 20, 2024 1:51 pm
by choi98
@park44 I don't think that's quite right, for what it's worth.
Battery placement (torso-centered vs backpack vs distributed through the limbs) is a real tradeoff between center-of-mass/balance considerations and thermal/cooling access - a torso-centered pack helps balance but is harder to cool than a more exposed backpack placement.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Thu Dec 26, 2024 9:10 am
by kwilliams
@choi98 Short answer:
The average humanoid in 2026 carries under 2.5 kWh of battery capacity, with real-world runtimes clustering between two and four hours depending on how dynamic the workload is - static, low-motion tasks stretch runtime much further than continuous walking or lifting.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Wed Jan 01, 2025 7:28 am
by pierregreen
One nitpick -
Hot-swappable battery packs solve the runtime bottleneck for continuous operations (like a 24/7 warehouse shift) without needing a much bigger, heavier pack, but they add mechanical complexity, a failure-prone connector interface, and logistics overhead for managing spare packs.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2025 1:18 pm
by matthew43
Counterpoint:
Regenerative braking on humanoid joints can recover some energy during deceleration phases of walking, but the actual energy recovered is modest compared to a vehicle, since humanoid joints don't sustain the same continuous high-speed rotation that makes regen worthwhile in EVs. Fast charging accelerates capacity fade over repeated cycles, so fleet operators generally have to choose between minimizing downtime (fast charging) and maximizing pack lifespan (slower charging or swap-based approaches) rather than getting both for free.
Re: How do you budget power reserve for emergency safe-shutdown sequences?
Posted: Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:40 pm
by park44
@matthew43 Agreed, and I'd add:
There's no widely standardized safety certification specific to humanoid battery packs yet in most jurisdictions - deployments generally lean on adapted versions of existing standards for industrial battery systems and electrical safety rather than a purpose-built humanoid standard.